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March 19, 2007
Skirting the Truth
Today in Sex Discrimination, we were talking about issues re: women in the legal field, including skirt suits v. pant suits at interviews. I got a little bit up on my high horse during the discussion, unfortunately, because I've always been of the opinion that a employer who needs to see my gams before hiring me is one I don't want to work for.
We talked about how those who make the choice to wear the skirt suit often do so out of fear, risk avoidance. We're not sure if employers care if we wear our femininity, but why take the chance?
Of course, there's a risk in not wearing the pant suit -- the chance to know it's the kind of firm who will hire you anyway (or that won't).
I felt a little bad afterward -- it's easy to practice my viewpoint in California, where the legal profession's dress codes are relaxed. We all have to make tough choices about how we present ourselves, both professionally and personally. Who am I to judge? I remember a distinct feeling of relief when I had enough work experience that I didn't have to list my college internship at NOW on my resume any more.
Dating is another area where you have to consider what to share and when -- e.g., when is the appropriate time to admit I've got 2 cats? Whom I ask for advice on which shoes look best with those jeans? That I'm a FUTURE LAWYER (see how they run)?
Usually I follow an "out with it" policy -- any man that can't love my cats, I can't love. I won't take the risk of not finding that out quickly. Even so, I hedge. I save the real scary stuff -- e.g., I like to embroider tea towels and sometimes greet Fred & Ethel with, "Mama's home!" -- 'til date #87 or so. It's a safer bet.
Posted by jen at March 19, 2007 11:07 PM
Comments
And then there are women like me who wear skirts most of the time because we have difficulty finding pants that fit right. Ones in my size are often too short. Of course, I am of the feeling that one should be able to wear whatever one wants and so I probably would have been indignant right along with you.
Posted by: Dagny at March 20, 2007 06:23 AM
Like Dagny, I also tend to wear skirts when I have to wear a suit because pants don't fit me well. (But unlike Dagny, it is because I am too short, not too tall.) But I remember advisers or whoever in law school telling us that women are supposed to wear skirts for interviews, and I was pissed. I'll wear whatever I want, thank you very much.
I would save the "Mama's home" story for the 87th date. Maybe the 86th, depending on how it's going. =)
Posted by: -R- at March 20, 2007 08:57 AM
I just have to say that starting any story with "Today in Sex Discrimination" is high-larious. Like Sex Discrimination is the name of a dance club or something.
Posted by: Librarian Girl at March 20, 2007 05:55 PM
I refuse to wear skirts. I hate them. I also despise pantyhose, and find that I lose the ability to think, work, or create when forced to wear skirts, hose and heels and sit with my knees primly clamped together all day.
Sorry, future employers, but if you want my creative talents to flow freely, my body can't be constricted.
I'm totally with you on this issue. If I go to an interview and they decline to hire me based solely on the fact that I'm in pants, then I don't need to work there.
Which is why I plan to be self-employed. ;-)
On the Big Reveal (I have five cats, two horses and I knit/weave/spin), I say just get it all out there. Again—you don't like my cats/horses/hobbies, we don't need to be together.
And I wonder why I'm single and jobless. LOL!
Posted by: Jeanne B. at March 20, 2007 07:47 PM
I'm finding that men with their own cats present a unique challenge--they would love my cats, but they also love their own cats, so whose place do we stay at? And at some point do we need to talk about step-cats?
Posted by: Anne at March 20, 2007 09:44 PM
As a "lady attorney" (yes that what I am called in an all male firm)in Denver, Colorado the skirt myth is true. Here the profession of law is very conservative and skirts, slips, hose, camisole, blouse, jacket, heels and jewelry will get you treated with more respect. Doesn't really make sense if you think about it.
I am wearing slacks today though... boss is in trial.
Posted by: Aimee the sis at March 21, 2007 09:49 AM
I want an embroidered tea towel.
Posted by: Gloria at March 21, 2007 10:57 AM
When I ponder this question, I can't help but think about the summer after my second year (shortly before the time that I came to my senses and decided that I didn't want to be a lawyer). I was clerking for a federal judge. All of his summer interns were women. We all wore the requisite suit with skirt. Thing is the pumps were killing us so we had a tendency to run around chambers in stocking feet -- literally. The men were not happy. We basically told them to suck it up. They did. Oh, and I'd like to point out that one of those suits that I wore. Magenta, baby.
Posted by: Dagny at March 21, 2007 08:38 PM
YaY! I am very happy to report that I wore pants to my interviews against the advice of my career center and just about every gal I know. I live in a bastion of conservatism as well as go to a school that doesn't have the same employment options as some of the others, but guess what? I still managed to get a summer clerkship. Maybe it's because the interviewers were listening to what I had to say rather than checking out my legs.
Posted by: Ana at March 21, 2007 09:19 PM
Conservativism? Con-serv-a? Whatever. It's really conservative where I live...and I'm really tired.
Posted by: Ana at March 21, 2007 09:22 PM
Dagny, I feel your pain. Except the long legs part, lucky lady.
-R-, sadly, that cat (ha! cat!) is so out of the bag.
LG, ha! I love that. Perhaps I should have added the word "class" for clarification, but I like your reading much better.
Jeane B., right on, sistah!
Anne, that is a world I have not yet considered. I am scared of melding cat worlds, and I wish you luck. My cats made it through living with a dog briefly, so I'm sure it will all work out!!
Aimee, I am sorry for your panty hose plight. And slips and camisoles! I had never even considered that people still had to do that -- you are a brave woman.
Gloria-- yeah, right after I finish those dishrags in pink and green for you.
Ana-- I think conservatism is a word, but I am too lazy to look it up. In any case, I use it in solidarity with you, my pants-wearing comrade.
Posted by: jen at March 21, 2007 11:57 PM
There was an excellent article on this in the WSJ last week. It talked about how men find it easier to dress casually, as a woman who tries to do so is seen as ceding some perceived authority. So, in response, women have to figure out how to casually accessorize the business "uniform."
I will say that LA is definitely not the place to be discussing this. I know a pair of married lawyers who work at a top firm in Century City. The guy wears polo shirts (or a tieless dress shirt) every day, unless he's seeing a client. Then he just puts on a jacket. The wife wears a simple blouse and pants to everything.
Oh, and about those cats. That's a "first date" piece of information, so good call by outing that right up front.
Posted by: DDJ at March 26, 2007 12:38 PM